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Tech Talk / Re: Oil condensation an a couple other things
« Last post by Bassman on December 06, 2017, 09:19:45 PM »
I was referring to this cam chain tensioner update.
They are hydraulic, came stock in 2007 and later.


https://www.harley-davidson.com/store/se-hydraulic-tensioner---oil-pump-upgrade

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Tech Talk / Re: Oil condensation an a couple other things
« Last post by charles on December 06, 2017, 04:32:41 PM »
  I was going to go with gear cams ,and after reading about what you just stated Bassman ,I decided to go with chain cams . I had my crank balanced ,welded ,bearings and the lock and set up on 3 thousandths end play ,but , sooner or later it will get run out from heat ,fatigue ,ect..... So I just went with the chain ,but I did use roller rockers to make a little less stress on the chain and on the valve guides . There's many people that have good luck useing the gear cams . Its too bad I didnt read up more on this oil system's particulars  and those tentioners before ,I could have saved myself some time an money . If your going to race your bike and ect.....That completely different than what Im talking about , I put this together with the intent of a dependable strong cruiser ,I like a little juice if I use it or not........
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Tech Talk / Re: Oil condensation an a couple other things
« Last post by Bassman on December 06, 2017, 02:32:02 PM »
The new tensioner upgrade seems good to me.
Has Teflon (or something like it) shoes, like cars have been using for years.
Those red ones are a piece of crap.
I also am using an S/S gear driving cam in another bike that worked good.
The problem with gear driven cams, the tolerance for crank TIR (total indicated runout) is .003 max.
Also, you have to change gears to set the correct backlash, if that is off.
Tolerances that are off a little will make the cam louder.

If you have more than .003 TIR, the Harley tensioner kit upgrade is the best way to go.

BTW: I run Royal Purple 20-50 synthetic with zero problems, two of my bikes have over 100,000 miles and no smoke.
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Tech Talk / Re: Oil condensation an a couple other things
« Last post by charles on December 06, 2017, 01:52:57 PM »
 After flushing my motor once (conventional cheap 20-50 pro line oil)-heating it up several times and letting it soak each time,I decided to take a short easy ride or 2 with the second flush cause the oil after heating it up a couple times didnt look half as yellow/tan as it did ,it was unbelieveable how much of that crap was in there ,no more lucas 20-50 MC full syn. or syn for me ! I dont know about all syn oil ,but that crap is a moisture  magnet . This past saturday decided to take a short easy ride to Bear's brother , since the oil was looking better and change oil when I got back home . I was about a mile from starting up the mountain ,looked down and the oil pressure was exactly half way between 0 and 32 on the oil pressure gauge at about 65 mph ,eased off some and pulled off at the foot of the mountain ,after a road side intense sermon ,no oil leaks ,let it cool a while , almost 0 idle pressure and I took it slow an easy back home with the same half way between oil pressure as above. After  a few burnt fingers the manuel oil pressure gauge showed almost 25 at idle and almost 50 a little above 3000 rpm .I have a new fueling plus high vol. oil pump ,new axtel oil bypass valve and new HD oil sender on the bike ,cold starts it completely pegs the oil pressure gauge ,so I suspected the condensation or something else had pluged the oil sender or it went bad , but I still knew something else was wrong even with the pressure the manuel gauge was showing . After the condensation problem and then this , and remembering the very small oil passages in the cam plate , I decided I had no choice but check the oil system ,so into the cam chest . Now this motor has many start ups over 2 years keeping it oiled up inside an ect....while I was finishing it  and only 50 or less road miles on it . Last nite I found the problem , RED SHIFT DUEL PISTON CAM CHAIN TENTIONERS ,there was a piece of plastic stuck to the oil pressure relief valve seat holding the relief valve open . I have a high vol. oil pump , but ,you would think they would make the shoe (plastic material ) that rides aginst the chain out of high quality material ,both shoes were ate up , the inside shoe was 3 times more ate up (deep) ,another piece of plastic was in the spacer ring that sets aginst the roll pin of the axtell relief valve . By looking at the wear on the  tentioner shoes its what you might see on 70,000 miles ,the stock shoes that came out of this motor didnt have a forth of the wear on them at 36,000 miles ,but ,it didnt have a high vol . pump , I wouldnt use the red shift tentioners if I was useing a stock oil pump after seeing this !  Im putting the stock oil pump back in ,with the stock relief valve ,Im going to try and seat the relief valve a little with some valve grinding compound (WASHING SEVERAL TIMES AFTERWARDS AND BLOWING OUT WITH THE AIR HOSE) and use the after market spacer to tighten the relief valve spring and the stock chain tentioners are going back in also , my problems may not be over yet with the plastic pieces . Some people try to stretch the oil pressure relief valve spring ,sure you can stretch it ,but your wasteing your time ,in a couple days a week or so it will be back like it was ,knew a guy that had a MG the stretched his relief valve spring about every 2 weeks to get oil pressure instead of just getting a new spring , even spring steel fatigue's  from heat and wear ,just like the springs on your vehicle get weaker over time . I also didnt care much for the way the oil pressure acted at times with the axtell oil pressure by pass relief valve is why Im putting the stock valve back in and theres no way to know how much , or how deep the oil gets in the cam chest where the valve dumps all the relief valve oil ,it could cause foaming and if it gets very deep it could go threw the crank bearing an cause sumping in the crank shaft side ,it may not do that with a stock pump ,dont know ,but there is a chance with a high vol. pump . After reading up some more on the oil system lately and what I found is why Im changeing things back............
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Tech Talk / Re: Softail Crotch Coolers/Heat Sheilds
« Last post by charles on December 01, 2017, 01:22:36 PM »
  Myself ,I dont think you can go wrong with V & H , they remind me of the early 70's  thrush header mufflers on cars . I put the V & H true duels headers and twin slash ovals 4.5 inch #16767 on mine ,and like the sound . Some people confuse these ovals with the monster ovals there 5.5 inch, and dont sound as good as the 4.5 inch, and the 4.5 is kind of an old school look ,another reason I got the ovals .
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BOTW MC General Discussion (Public) / MAVRICK
« Last post by Shane Fisher on November 29, 2017, 08:11:09 PM »
Iím looking for pictures of MAVRICK, from the time he was in Heartland Chapter to Kanawha Valley Chapter. If anyone has any please feel free to Send the to my email. Iím short on pictures of my father and itís hard to find them anywhere.  Shane.fisher1995@gmail.com it would be greatly appreciated Thank you.
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Tech Talk / Re: Softail Crotch Coolers/Heat Sheilds
« Last post by Bassman on November 27, 2017, 10:37:49 AM »
With all the changes, I get about 50 mpg at 60 or 65 mph, not sure about before the changes.
As speed goes up after 65, the mileage goes down.
At 75 mph, mileage drops into the low to mid 40's I'm guessing.
In town it's in the low 40's.
I also have a race tuner and the Vance & Hines pipes (Big Shots), the package works well together.
I downloaded the race tuner program from Harley and remapped the ECM with my laptop.
Ride Safe,
Bassman
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Tech Talk / Softail Crotch Coolers/Heat Sheilds
« Last post by leon-bed on November 27, 2017, 04:46:14 AM »
Looks good. Got any data for us on mpg changes with/without the K&N and w/wo the heat shield? Im curious
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Tech Talk / Re: Oil condensation an a couple other things
« Last post by charles on November 23, 2017, 01:54:10 PM »
  In the early 70's when service (gas) stations worked on vehicles ,sold an fixed tires,washed cars ,ect.... The station I worked at a while had a very good bubble balancer . And before you attempt to balance a tire you need to know, its not uncommon for a tire to have more than 1 heavy spot or a long heavy spot ,focus on the heaviest spot first, then the other, if any . AND REMEMBER water inside the tire even a few drops will cause balanceing problems ,use a rag to dampen the tire an wheel with water when mounting the tire ,dont use soap on aluminum wheels . Wipe the tread off if you rolled it on the floor before balanceing and all water off of the tire an wheel ,it all makes a difference . Tire makeing has came a long way so they say ,I still see people with broke belts thumping as they go by and tires still have to be balanced and at times rebalanced after they wear a while and some times the balanceing weights come off . There is a spacer between the 2 wheel bearings, and even if there wasnt, its important to have a STRAIGHT rod to balance with, any hump in the rod wont allow the tire to roll correctly while balanceing when the hump on the rod comes to the top side . You can use the narrow edge of a frameing square with the rod centered on, an roll the rod to check if its straight or use a aluminum frameing level surface or t-square ,it helps to have a light at the back side while checking . Hardware galvanized rod isnt straight . You might find a good piece of stainless steel rod that is straight . 18" long , is plenty long enough . I have cvo wheels and theres no flat ledge to put weights on at the spokes ,the spokes are a steep slope an the weights will just fly off,you could break down the tire an move the tire around the wheel a little and maybe get the heavy spot lined up with the slot/flat ledge to put weights on ,but how many times will it take breaking it down . The heavy spot on mine wasnt in the center of the spoke ,it took six -1/4 oz weights ,I put 2 weights at the heavy side of the spoke an 1 on the other side of the spoke on the valve side and the same amount of weight on the other side of the wheel lined up with each other . Appx. a forth of the way around the wheel from the weights I put on, I had another spot that took one -1/4 oz weight . I only had 1/4 weights, you need 1/8 also ,I found some small L .-1/4 weights a local tire shop ,you can cut the 1/4 for smaller weight ,but if you mess up the glue on the stick on part it will not stay on the wheel . I got a couple 1/2" inside diameter bearings from a starter an alternator rebuild shop ,washed out all the grease out an used wd40 an left the rubber seals off while I was useing them ,3 in 1 oil would work also . Rolling about 5 inches at a time an stop all the way around the tire,letting go of it without causeing it to roll, to see if the wheel would set still by its self ,if it trys to roll either direction ,hold the tire with a finger get a hold of the rod and turn the rod about a half turn an try it agin ,I had to keep checking if the rod was causeing it to roll or if the weight needed adjusted because the rod wasnt completely straight . I balanced my belt pulley also,it took one-1/4 oz weight ,I had to sand the rough texture paint smooth at the under side edge of the pulley where it was flat ,the weight wont stay stuck to the rough paint  and it was the pulley so I used super glue up onto the weight to help keep the weight there . They make duck tape several colors ,if you suspect your wheel weights may come off , and you can get the tape glue off .......I used masking tape to stick the weights on till I knew how much and had the tire balanced ,You have to wash the place your going to stick the wheel weight good with alcohol or , ........
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